Re: Time travel(control) with Dr. David Anderson on Art Bell

by Nucky Wed Apr 14, 2010 8:30 pm

I just listened to the first hour . . . and so far I'm very skeptical. I think I'm going to need to see tangible evidence before I'll be convinced that this actually happened. How do we know that this isn't just a bunch of geeks messing with our heads, or overzealous researchers hastily jumping to conclusions, or that there isn't some other explanation for what allegedly happened? One of the above seems much more likely to me.

Right now I'm in a place where the principal of Occam's razor is taking over my mind and I'm having a bit of a crisis of faith in metaphysical mumbo jumbo in general I'm afraid. I'm not knocking anyone's beliefs here. I'm just in a place where I can't accept things on faith alone right now. I need tangible evidence.

by RBM Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:20 pm

Nucky wrote:I need tangible evidence

Excellent policy.

But, as I have mentioned before in so many different words, life is so complex and overwhelming we often use 'aides' to help determine value of evidence.

My level of credibility has been met by virtue of going further than you have so far. At this point a 'tentative conclusion' would indicate an skeptical open mind. Anything more would indicate a closed mind, in one direction. Anything less would indicate a sucker mind (a la PT Barnum), in the other direction.

Hope you get to something more stable than 'faith'. Good Luck.

by Nucky Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:52 pm

I do reach tentative conclusions on some things when there is substantial evidence in favor of them. But with outrageous stuff like this I'm a "pics/tangible evidence or it didn't happen" kind of person. It sounds cool and I'd like to believe it, but I just can't right now.

by Nucky Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:18 pm

OK, regarding Part 2:

They say that time paradoxes are possible, and that the rational human mind cannot grasp the concept of the contradictions that paradoxes present. This can neither be proven nor disproven, and as such is not scientific.

by Nucky Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:43 pm

I just finished hour 3, so I watched as much as what is still posted on Youtube.

I'm still skeptical, but I find the ethical concerns that it brings up thought-provoking nonetheless.

by jaded Fri Apr 16, 2010 11:28 am

RBM I am not well schooled as you know. One day when you have the time, could you give me a dumbed down version of this so I can understand?

My son believes wholeheartedly in time travel. I do not understand the concept of it. The idea intrigues me & scares me a bit.
thanks

by RBM Fri Apr 16, 2010 8:13 pm

Jaded. I'm not sure I can add anything from the Dr. Anderson show.

I think one point of the show was exactly what MelodicColor caught: ( to paraphrase from memory) 'We don't view reality as it is, but as we are.'

From my MBT reading - time is ONLY ... NOW.

Anything else that comes to mind about the nature of time is brought by the individual and their subjective experience.

by Nucky Thu May 27, 2010 7:15 pm

So if the future in a sense has already happened, knowing this would cause some people to say "f*@! it, my future's already predetermined, nothing I can do about it." A prime example of how it is indeed possible to know too much for one's own good. The illusion of unpredetermined futures is what motivates mankind.

by melodiccolor Thu May 27, 2010 8:49 pm

Nucky, one could conclude that about time and free will. However I posted the following--free will does exist and it is not dependent on time or so it seems:

melodiccolor wrote:
What really matters is what an Empath - or anyone else - does toward other sentient beings, do they act from the heart ?
This is very true. And not just toward other sentient beings but all life. It is all part of the whole and so it all matters. (Pun not intended but it applies anyway--my subconscious underlayers at work! )

Anyhow, I have continued to process in the back of my mind what I've heard so far and this is what I've come up with:

It doesn't matter if time has been played with or altered or will be because it already happened and it is a record in the whole of the space/time/consciousness continuum.

Also, free will is independent of linear time. Linear time is an artificial construct but free will exists anyway. It affects the whole of the space/time/consciousness continuum. Therefore, that coninuum must be in a state of flux in its natural form even without time experiments being added to the equation.

I'm about to listen to the fourth hour. What happens next is going to be interesting no matter what.

Dr Anderson intuits that consciousness is a information point in the continuum and as such can't be created or destroyed. It can however be transformed. But this was in regards to consciousness existing outside of our present life. This is an issue I had been thinking about as have most of us no doubt.

by RBM Tue Feb 01, 2011 12:38 pm

An update in the form of another data point on the topic of time -

I have recently read the second book by the late Robert Monroe (RAM), Far Journeys.

One instance prompts this post. The instance is when RAM visits Earth during a time frame called '3000 Plus'.

This suggests, at minimum, that Time is not linear as is the conventional perspective from inside the physical matter reality.

by frmthhrt Tue Feb 01, 2011 1:51 pm

Okay, call me a skeptic...it's my INTP nature (but I do believe in Bigfoot, and UFOs, although I don't claim they are necessarily aliens...)...but I do like to check into things...and googling around I find this:

Just a heads up. Dr. Anderson is a total fraud. I've never heard someone say SO much without saying anything at all. Check out his website. Anderson Multinational
Dig a little deeper into his links. Check out all the "companies" "services" & "technology" Heeeheeeheee. It's really funny. This guy set up a web of nothingness to give the perception that he's the real deal. Every single one of these sites is a turnkey, cookie-cutter flash site that can be set up for like $12. He plays the same game with his "timetech" he's simply parroting theories from books and hiding behind secrecy. He's a joke.
I'm sort of ashamed that I wasted 10 minutes of my life—but I wrote those asshats at C2C to point this out but I'm sure they could care less

It turns out there are a series of books including one called "Transylvania Sunrise", by Peter Moon, which are part of a series of ummm...sci-fi novels in the L.Ron Hubbard tradition:

[url]http://www.skybooksusa.com/books/pmoon.htm [url]

Tells of Peter Moon’s adventure to Romania to meet the enigmatic time travel scientist Dr. David Anderson and the latter’s
mysterious association with Radu Cinamar, a Romanian intelligence officer who tells the story of the greatest archaeological discovery in history: a holographic hall of records
beneath the Romanian Sphinx

Apparently these books are based on "the legend of Ong's Hat".

More stuff from others looking into the story:

Re: Time Travel and Dr. David Anderson
I spent some time digging around the web and couldn't find anything.
From his defunct wiki page:
"David Lewis Anderson (born in Weirton, West Virginia) is a physicist and United Nations Ambassador for Youth [citation needed]whose interests are in spacetime physics, special relativity and global community service. Anderson received degrees in engineering from West Virginia University (BSEE)[citation needed] and California State University (MSE)[citation needed] and Ph.D.s in physics and philosophy from the Joint-Services Military College[citation needed][citation needed], respectively. He was employed by the United States Air Force under the Air Force Systems Command conducting research and development at[citation needed] Air Force Flight Test Center (AFFTC) at Edwards Air Force Base in the Mojave Desert. Anderson's theories on time and energy have received significant coverage during his appearances[1][2][3][4] on national shows including Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell, his appearances on Other World Radio[5], and also as the narrator and host of the book and video documentary "Time Travel, Journeys into Time."[6] He has also made many appearances on radio and television in Europe and Asia discussing time and time technology.[citation needed]
Anderson's most notable theories focus on time-warped fields[7] and time reactor designs[8] that suggest the possibility to harvest energy from curved spacetime surrounding the earth caused by inertial frame dragging. He has published many articles[9] on the subject of time and spacetime physics that have been published on the internet and in media such as the Leading Edge International Research Journal[10] and the Spacetime Journal[11] and supports education of youth through regular lectures at schools throughout the United States and Europe.
Anderson is the president and founder of Anderson Multinational LLC based in Rochester, New York. Anderson's achievements in developing science and educational opportunities for youth earned him an appointment[12] in 2002 as an Ambassador for Youth for the United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) and appointment[13] in 2003 as an Ambassador for Youth for the Government of Romania. Anderson's global community service programs are managed through his foundation called the World Genesis Foundation whose mission is to "leave no child without hope for the future.""

Since it is the weekend, and the registrars offices are presumably closed, I will start with what I could find. There is no entity called the Joint-Services Military College. There is an entity called Joint Military Intelligence College.
Next he claims to have papers published in the Leading Edge International Research Journal (trufax.org), which sells books called the Matrix Series written by John Lear. I also did a search for The Spacetime Journal and the ISBN number listed on the bio page of andersoninstitute.com and came up with nothing, nada. Doing a search at the UN and UNESCO websites for "David Anderson", "David Lewis Anderson", "World Genesis", "Atlantykron" and "Ambassador for Youth" again brings up nothing other to bring to light the fact that there are no "Ambassadors for Youth", just "Youth Ambassadors" which is entirely different.

After a few more minutes of digging I have become fairly certain that the interview is a trailhead to an Alternate Reality Game that may be related to Ong's Hat. I posted the information at the unfiction forums so they can get started and so we can remove Dr. Anderson from any future discussion. If anyone would like the details I will post them, just ask.
Anderson is listed as the owner or admin for the Worldgenesis.org and atlantykron.org domains.

I went looking, and found two real physicists using the name David Anderson...one died in 1991, the other is a research scientist at U.C. Berkeley, that is a computer specialist, and has nothing to do with time travel!

"Atlantykon" is a Sci-Fi writer convention...not a scientific convention....

by RBM Tue Feb 01, 2011 3:47 pm

Got some links on which the assertion in your first quote is based ? Who's making the assertion would be a start.

I'm not clear of what exactly is the fraud part ?

by frmthhrt Tue Feb 01, 2011 4:30 pm

Well, the address for the "Anderson Institute" and "Anderson Multinational LLC" is a box in a UPS store...Google Earth will take you there...
As I quoted, someone else has done like I did...followed the trail, and found nothing...
Can you find a trace of "the Anderson Institute New Mexico, UNITED STATES of AMERICA" ? I can't.
The address for one of the companies that the main shell company links to "Anderson Scientific" , takes us back to the same UPS store...while the picture on the website shows skyscrapers on the waterline somewhere far away...
Just for fun I clicked on a product, and the message says "shipped from and sold by Amazon.com". Proceed to checkout, and is Amazon. The whole thing is a fake.
I know a scam when I see one. This is an elaborate concoction out of thin air...like so many of these "gurus" turn out to be. It does sell plenty of books though. Sorry.
The sad part is, the guy may have some great ideas...I can't say one way or another myself, other than spouting my own beliefs...but his credibility is now zero in my books, strictly because of the chicanery used to pretend to be a legitimate multinational corporation and institute.

by melodiccolor Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:56 pm

It does appear that David Andersen used some good theories about time to concoct an elaborate fraud... a masterful con game. Perhaps it is just as well that space/time are not being messed with.

I still maintain that the ideas of time/space being whole and nonlinear are correct; likely he got those from elsewhere and just incorporated them into the "interview".

My intuitive posts following still feel right. It's just a shame that what inspired them seems to be fraudulent.

by frmthhrt Tue Feb 01, 2011 6:14 pm

I have no problem with the ideas on time! We all have to trust our own intuition about these things.

by RBM Tue Feb 01, 2011 6:36 pm

hahaha

Maybe scam, maybe not ?? What can you buy at the Amazon link ?

I suspect something is going on, but it doesn't fit a typical scam MO to my way of thinking - his bio-related pages are no longer up.

Peswiki's pages look about the same but I have no reference as I didn't dig into that site on his pages before.

I'm still poking around some other places to see what pops up - or doesn't !

Well here's someone else that is looking for 'DAL', e Bizarre Mystery Of Anderson Multinational:

not DLA. He showed up with Heather in a senior rv park in Arizona. This is their second season with us. We had some negative feelings, and googled his name……So what to do? Seems some of his web sites have not been updated since 2008-09. Kinda dropped out.., and we think he is gathering info. from the seniors for what? The only hot tip is we know where he is. We are contacting the local pd for more info. WE NEED A LIFE! Thanks, JER

A scamster hanging out in a senior rv park ?

This adds up to something unusual but 'scam' seems to miss also.

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